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good morning good afternoon to everyone

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wherever you may be i'm andy burnett um

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i am one of the organizers for this

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overall road mapping event and i have a

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couple of colleagues with me

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stavros i suppose actually just pointing

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from my end doesn't really help and uh

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to my left my colleague tim morley um

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and hopefully we'll be meeting many of

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you when we come to the face-to-face

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uh workshop on this now in the intro um

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for the technical overview mike did

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mention that we're recording everything

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but just in case anyone joined just

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after he he'd said that um for full

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disclosure all we're doing is we're

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recording these sessions and we'll put

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them up there's a youtube

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channel and

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so everything that we say in the chat

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window or that uh that anyone talks

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about participants and presenters will

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be available on the uh on the internet

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now

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this is the first of a series of

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webinars which are designed to build up

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um

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our collective understanding on the

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topics which will then apply in the road

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mapping workshop um and our hope is that

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workshop will involve people

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participating both physically and

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virtually so

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i think it's important to recognize that

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this is a an ongoing process but these

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uh first

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webinars are very important parts of the

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input for that

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so we have um assembled a panel to give

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us provocative thoughts we have the

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opportunity to do q a during this

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webinar and there is if you are not

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aware of it already there is a website

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astrobiologyfuture.org we encourage

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everyone to register there we will be

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holding discussions on that following

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each of the webinars

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and

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we'll then be taking the input from that

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and that forms part of the input for the

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roadmapping workshop um now i see i've

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got sean

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in

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the group here i don't have michael sean

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at this point let me just ask is there

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anything that you want to add and i'm

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hoping that you have the ability

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to talk because i see you're in the

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participants list

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so

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if i have just silence of the oh hang on

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hello excuse my ignorance hey

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um is there anything that you want to

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add by way of intro for the participants

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on this

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uh i would i think i would just

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echo thanks to everyone that's going to

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participate because we we really value

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this activity and think it's important

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to

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get as much community involvement as

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possible and setting a future course for

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the field and for all of these different

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brilliant

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all right thanks very much um

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let me start then by just asking the

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panelists to introduce themselves

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briefly and i'll start on my left

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hi so i'm victoria meadows i'm the

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principal investigator for the nasa

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astrobiology institute's virtual

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planetary laboratory i'm also the

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director for the astrobiology graduate

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program here at university of washington

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and i was trained as a planetary

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astronomer and i'm very interested in

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questions of extrasolar planet

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habitability

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cool

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tori

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i am a chemist by background and and

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then have training in oceanography

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i work now mostly in microsoft

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ecosystems but always with an eye toward

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better understanding

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what habitability is and how organisms

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excellent chris

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i'm chris house i'm a professor of

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geosciences at penn state i'm also the

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director for the penn state astrobiology

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research center

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my background is degrees is in

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biochemistry and in geology

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and my interest

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uh microbial life in unusual places its

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metabolism and the signatures that it

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thank you

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and kelsey

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hi

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university in st louis and i just

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completed my phd studying the itunes

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wounds of jupiter and saturn and i'm

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going to be starting a postdoc

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looking at earth's moons a little bit

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closer to home

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and what i do is currently do is

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consider geology and geophysics

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excellent okay thank you very much

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um now

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mike at this point i'm just going to ask

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we had a slide pack

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it's amazing isn't it power of the mind

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and uh to change slides and use the

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arrow icons at the bottom of that share

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pod gotcha thank you

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and just to remind folks we we do have a

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few open mics if you can press pound uh

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sorry star six that will mute your

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microphone and then we won't hear as

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much of the background static some of

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you might be hearing now thanks

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fantastic thank you

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um

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okay

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when i first saw this slide which was

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put together i call it what i have to

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admit every time i um

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when i see the telescopes it just

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distracts me from whatever it says next

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to it so just focusing on the words for

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a moment

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done opens welcoming the agenda for

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today is fairly straightforward uh as

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i've already outlined so what i wanted

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to do i'm going to skip over

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this slide i wanted to move to what

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we've actually asked the panelists to

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talk about

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and the format we'd like to use is

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really just to invite whoever wants to

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go first on this michael hello

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um

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to to kick us off with our first

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question um with regards to astrobiology

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for the non-scientists so we're not

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looking for rather stilted responses

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from everyone we want to get the

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thoughts whoever wants to go first how

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do you go about tackling this and my

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colleague stavros is going to monitor

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our chat window as well and so every so

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often we might

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poke people with another question

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all right i guess i'll jump in

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starting with the first one uh how would

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i describe astrobiology for solar system

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exploration

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to a non-scientist i guess i would say

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that um you know there are there are

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both theoretical and

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practical concrete aspects to what we do

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in astrobiology uh and and when it comes

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time to actually go looking when it

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comes time to mount a search you have to

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settle on some

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uh concrete specifics that you use to

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parameterize whatever tools you're

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you're observing with uh or decide where

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to where to observe to begin with and

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there's a certain amount that can be

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done here at home by examining

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ecosystems that we have right here

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understanding life and its more general

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aspects

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that can take you some distance along

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the way to deciding what those concrete

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specifics should be and so in my mind at

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least

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this particular part of the discussion

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um

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relates to uh to how do you

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you know how do you study and understand

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systems here on earth in order to better

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other thoughts

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i can't share something

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okay uh yeah so i also kind of thought

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we might have similar answers to this

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question but um

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i guess i just wanted to emphasize that

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at least for me um the interdisciplinary

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nature how we can't answer these

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questions about life without having all

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these uh different fields come together

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um

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and so you know besides just being a big

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umbrella term

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for all this research that can relate to

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life in the universe which is a very big

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topic

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i like the fact that it's really like we

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have to come together to be able to do

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this we couldn't do it in our individual

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chris

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yeah i mean i agree with both tori and

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kelsey i want to just

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i guess add that that this is one of the

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central questions in astrobiology is to

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ultimately take the knowledge and

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go out and search

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um and so we need

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both time-tested approaches and some

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out-of-the-box approaches in order to

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get time-tested approaches you have to

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use those approaches here on earth and

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in different environments past and

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present and to get out of the box sort

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of approaches you also need to spend

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some effort and some time and

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looking at ecosystems and environments

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and unusual environments as well as

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victoria do you want around nothing on

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that um yeah yeah so i agree i mean one

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of the major components of this theme is

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is sort of taking what we can learn from

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earth life and environments to try and

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understand potentially habitable

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environments you know that might exist

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on solar system planets and satellites

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and extrasolar planets um but also i

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believe part of this theme is also

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looking at biosignatures and and part of

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that is is looking at sort of the effect

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that life has on its environment on this

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planet here where we have you know the

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only example of a known

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inhabited planet at the moment and

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determining how those effects might be

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different for different environments

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sort of for for more non-earth-like or

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non-earth type environments um so for

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example i sort of think of you know

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based on what i can learn about earth

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buyer signatures what might i be looking

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for on extrasolar planets that have say

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a different composition or a different

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for for the non-scientists

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what is it that's fundamentally

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different about astrobiology from

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biology

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is it

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difficult

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um

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yeah sure i was just going to say

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astrobiology may not be biology at all i

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mean astrobiology is kind of a blanket

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term for a very interdisciplinary uh

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study

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and at its core of course we have this

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search for life in the universe but you

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can still be an astrobiologist and and

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sort of study interiors of planets or or

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whatever uh as long as you're feeding

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into this theme of trying to understand

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the distribution and type of habit of

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worlds that might be out there so the

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difference between i think astrobiology

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and biology is you know biology is a

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specific discipline that looks at life

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whereas astrobiology brings together

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many disciplines to answer the question

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of where life is in the universe and

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where we might find it and what it might

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be like

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yeah i would add something to that that

285
00:11:21,590 --> 00:11:19,839
that for me goes to

286
00:11:23,750 --> 00:11:21,600
each of the next two questions and that

287
00:11:25,990 --> 00:11:23,760
is i think that biology has followed a

288
00:11:27,750 --> 00:11:26,000
path that is appropriately very specific

289
00:11:30,150 --> 00:11:27,760
i mean the revolution that's happening

290
00:11:31,910 --> 00:11:30,160
in biology over the last decade or so

291
00:11:33,509 --> 00:11:31,920
is enabled by tools that are incredibly

292
00:11:35,110 --> 00:11:33,519
specific to our kind of life and our

293
00:11:37,030 --> 00:11:35,120
kind of biochemistry and i think one of

294
00:11:39,670 --> 00:11:37,040
the real critical needs

295
00:11:41,110 --> 00:11:39,680
uh in astrobiology for for defining what

296
00:11:42,630 --> 00:11:41,120
are appropriate biosignatures for

297
00:11:44,470 --> 00:11:42,640
understanding what habitability really

298
00:11:46,310 --> 00:11:44,480
means is that we need to take a more

299
00:11:48,150 --> 00:11:46,320
general perspective and understand life

300
00:11:49,430 --> 00:11:48,160
in its fundamental aspects and and in

301
00:11:50,949 --> 00:11:49,440
some way

302
00:11:52,150 --> 00:11:50,959
you know in some forms

303
00:11:53,910 --> 00:11:52,160
um

304
00:11:55,750 --> 00:11:53,920
that runs a little bit different to the

305
00:11:58,710 --> 00:11:55,760
way that biology is unfolding a lot of

306
00:12:00,150 --> 00:11:58,720
the tools that we use are similar

307
00:12:01,910 --> 00:12:00,160
but i think the perspective that we have

308
00:12:03,910 --> 00:12:01,920
to take on the life itself is different

309
00:12:05,590 --> 00:12:03,920
rather than an incredibly specific

310
00:12:08,310 --> 00:12:05,600
perspective i think we need to be

311
00:12:09,430 --> 00:12:08,320
generalists and so in some ways

312
00:12:11,590 --> 00:12:09,440
you know the biology part in

313
00:12:13,030 --> 00:12:11,600
astrobiology is as much chemistry as it

314
00:12:15,110 --> 00:12:13,040
is uh

315
00:12:16,629 --> 00:12:15,120
biology and and for me that becomes

316
00:12:20,710 --> 00:12:16,639
important in considering these next two

317
00:12:24,870 --> 00:12:22,790
chris earlier on i saw you flick

318
00:12:27,269 --> 00:12:24,880
yourself off mute was there something

319
00:12:29,350 --> 00:12:27,279
you wanted to add on there

320
00:12:30,949 --> 00:12:29,360
well i was just uh i i think victoria

321
00:12:33,430 --> 00:12:30,959
had said basically what i was going to

322
00:12:34,870 --> 00:12:33,440
say is that the critical

323
00:12:36,550 --> 00:12:34,880
one of the critical differences between

324
00:12:38,389 --> 00:12:36,560
astrobiology and biology is certainly

325
00:12:40,150 --> 00:12:38,399
not just hardcore biology it is

326
00:12:41,990 --> 00:12:40,160
fundamentally different fields

327
00:12:44,069 --> 00:12:42,000
and victoria covered that

328
00:12:46,949 --> 00:12:44,079
and i also agree with tori that it's

329
00:12:51,110 --> 00:12:46,959
very much chemistry and geochemistry and

330
00:12:52,550 --> 00:12:51,120
geology because we're talking about

331
00:12:54,949 --> 00:12:52,560
uh um

332
00:12:57,509 --> 00:12:54,959
looking for the chemistry of life

333
00:12:58,629 --> 00:12:57,519
byproducts of life in the atmosphere

334
00:13:05,750 --> 00:12:58,639
metaboli

335
00:13:07,269 --> 00:13:05,760
not necessarily what biologists do

336
00:13:12,230 --> 00:13:07,279
when they're they're very specific

337
00:13:17,509 --> 00:13:14,870
michael can you can you hear us and do

338
00:13:19,590 --> 00:13:17,519
you have a mic

339
00:13:20,470 --> 00:13:19,600
yeah i do

340
00:13:22,870 --> 00:13:20,480
okay

341
00:13:25,750 --> 00:13:22,880
um so thankful uh

342
00:13:28,150 --> 00:13:25,760
yeah we can so for our participants

343
00:13:29,910 --> 00:13:28,160
because michael um joined just at the

344
00:13:32,829 --> 00:13:29,920
start of this actually would you like to

345
00:13:37,190 --> 00:13:35,110
yourself michael new i'm the

346
00:13:38,470 --> 00:13:37,200
astrobiology discipline scientist nasa

347
00:13:40,710 --> 00:13:38,480
headquarters

348
00:13:43,590 --> 00:13:40,720
uh which means i helped run the

349
00:13:45,670 --> 00:13:43,600
astrobiology program

350
00:13:47,350 --> 00:13:45,680
part that running the astrology program

351
00:13:50,870 --> 00:13:47,360
means uh putting this kind of thing

352
00:13:56,790 --> 00:13:50,880
together and trying to develop a broadly

353
00:13:59,750 --> 00:13:57,829
and

354
00:14:02,310 --> 00:13:59,760
you were responsible along with your

355
00:14:04,069 --> 00:14:02,320
colleagues for starting to pull together

356
00:14:06,150 --> 00:14:04,079
some of these questions

357
00:14:08,470 --> 00:14:06,160
is there anything that you want to add

358
00:14:10,790 --> 00:14:08,480
in terms of um

359
00:14:12,310 --> 00:14:10,800
describing what you do

360
00:14:13,670 --> 00:14:12,320
to the non-scientists because i imagine

361
00:14:16,870 --> 00:14:13,680
you must have to do this on a fairly

362
00:14:20,710 --> 00:14:16,880
regular basis

363
00:14:22,550 --> 00:14:20,720
well the usual description i give is

364
00:14:24,150 --> 00:14:22,560
we're looking for evidence of life in

365
00:14:25,509 --> 00:14:24,160
the soul in this solar system or other

366
00:14:26,310 --> 00:14:25,519
solar systems

367
00:14:28,150 --> 00:14:26,320
and

368
00:14:30,550 --> 00:14:28,160
the only example of life we have is

369
00:14:32,389 --> 00:14:30,560
earth and so we try to use what we know

370
00:14:34,470 --> 00:14:32,399
about the origin the evolution the

371
00:14:37,269 --> 00:14:34,480
distribution of life on earth

372
00:14:39,829 --> 00:14:37,279
uh in the future of life in order

373
00:14:41,590 --> 00:14:39,839
to try to extrapolate to other bodies

374
00:14:42,790 --> 00:14:41,600
other places and sources from other

375
00:14:45,590 --> 00:14:42,800
places in

376
00:14:48,069 --> 00:14:45,600
the universe so that's basically my

377
00:14:50,470 --> 00:14:48,079
three second uh elevator speech for what

378
00:14:52,949 --> 00:14:50,480
it is i do

379
00:14:55,269 --> 00:14:52,959
cool thank you

380
00:14:56,710 --> 00:14:55,279
all right um stamveros i've been just

381
00:14:58,389 --> 00:14:56,720
looking out of the corner of my eyes so

382
00:15:01,350 --> 00:14:58,399
anything we want to pick up

383
00:15:02,470 --> 00:15:01,360
from the chat at the moment because i

384
00:15:04,470 --> 00:15:02,480
see uh

385
00:15:06,389 --> 00:15:04,480
where's my quite a few people quite a

386
00:15:08,069 --> 00:15:06,399
few people were expressing their their

387
00:15:09,350 --> 00:15:08,079
answer to the question which i think is

388
00:15:11,350 --> 00:15:09,360
great and there's a nice little back

389
00:15:13,670 --> 00:15:11,360
channel chat going on we'll have about

390
00:15:15,269 --> 00:15:13,680
20 minutes of comment and q a at the end

391
00:15:18,310 --> 00:15:15,279
but please continue the back channel

392
00:15:22,150 --> 00:15:18,320
chatting it's very engaging

393
00:15:26,710 --> 00:15:25,509
but quick question for michael knew

394
00:15:28,550 --> 00:15:26,720
and i don't know

395
00:15:30,150 --> 00:15:28,560
obviously other people can also have

396
00:15:32,069 --> 00:15:30,160
answers to this question

397
00:15:34,710 --> 00:15:32,079
but coming from the planetary science

398
00:15:37,910 --> 00:15:34,720
side i'm actually not super familiar

399
00:15:40,629 --> 00:15:37,920
with what the ultimate purposes of the

400
00:15:43,110 --> 00:15:40,639
astrobiology roadmap are what they'll

401
00:15:45,670 --> 00:15:43,120
this document will be used for and how

402
00:15:49,350 --> 00:15:45,680
it's different from detailed surveys

403
00:15:52,550 --> 00:15:50,710
okay so

404
00:15:55,189 --> 00:15:52,560
astrobiology doesn't have a decadal

405
00:15:57,189 --> 00:15:55,199
survey it's we're a sub-part of the

406
00:15:58,949 --> 00:15:57,199
planetary science division

407
00:16:01,110 --> 00:15:58,959
so if you go to look at the planetary

408
00:16:03,189 --> 00:16:01,120
science uh the cable survey that came

409
00:16:05,509 --> 00:16:03,199
out about a year ago

410
00:16:07,749 --> 00:16:05,519
there is no section called astrobiology

411
00:16:09,829 --> 00:16:07,759
but if you read it

412
00:16:13,430 --> 00:16:09,839
ideas from astrobiology completely

413
00:16:16,550 --> 00:16:15,509
because we never had a decadal survey

414
00:16:18,870 --> 00:16:16,560
per se

415
00:16:20,790 --> 00:16:18,880
and because we've always wanted

416
00:16:22,710 --> 00:16:20,800
astrobiology to have some kind of

417
00:16:24,470 --> 00:16:22,720
grounding in what the community thinks

418
00:16:26,310 --> 00:16:24,480
is important

419
00:16:27,829 --> 00:16:26,320
we've been developing these roadmaps we

420
00:16:30,470 --> 00:16:27,839
did the first one in

421
00:16:32,710 --> 00:16:30,480
2003 it was a revision

422
00:16:35,350 --> 00:16:32,720
a big major revision and then

423
00:16:38,150 --> 00:16:35,360
2008 was a minor tweak

424
00:16:39,990 --> 00:16:38,160
and now it's time to really reset it and

425
00:16:41,829 --> 00:16:40,000
ask you know what have we done will be

426
00:16:45,350 --> 00:16:41,839
accomplished and what are our goals for

427
00:16:47,590 --> 00:16:45,360
the next 10 years so in a sense it is a

428
00:16:49,990 --> 00:16:47,600
it's more like a science strategy than

429
00:16:52,069 --> 00:16:50,000
it is a cable survey in that it doesn't

430
00:16:54,230 --> 00:16:52,079
say you shall do this mission or you

431
00:16:56,470 --> 00:16:54,240
must do these measurements but it lays

432
00:16:58,870 --> 00:16:56,480
out the science uh

433
00:17:00,389 --> 00:16:58,880
goals objectives and experiments that

434
00:17:06,630 --> 00:17:00,399
you kind of want to do

435
00:17:11,350 --> 00:17:08,710
great

436
00:17:13,270 --> 00:17:11,360
all right so we we've sort of outlined

437
00:17:15,669 --> 00:17:13,280
our understanding of how we explain it

438
00:17:17,829 --> 00:17:15,679
and uh why it's uh

439
00:17:20,309 --> 00:17:17,839
why it's so challenging in some ways

440
00:17:23,350 --> 00:17:20,319
let's move on to the second point about

441
00:17:25,590 --> 00:17:23,360
the most important research um for

442
00:17:26,949 --> 00:17:25,600
identifying extraterrestrial life and i

443
00:17:28,710 --> 00:17:26,959
have to admit even saying

444
00:17:30,710 --> 00:17:28,720
extraterrestrial life i find quite

445
00:17:31,590 --> 00:17:30,720
exciting um

446
00:17:33,750 --> 00:17:31,600
so

447
00:17:35,590 --> 00:17:33,760
what do we have to do

448
00:17:50,549 --> 00:17:35,600
what's the critical research we've got

449
00:17:53,190 --> 00:17:51,909
i mean i suppose this is one where we're

450
00:17:55,669 --> 00:17:53,200
all gonna be a little bit more biased

451
00:17:58,710 --> 00:17:55,679
but in my own opinion um i would say

452
00:18:02,310 --> 00:17:58,720
that that we need to be focusing on on

453
00:18:04,789 --> 00:18:02,320
chemistry and geochemistry that is

454
00:18:06,470 --> 00:18:04,799
a product of life that can indirectly

455
00:18:10,150 --> 00:18:06,480
detect to tell us whether life was

456
00:18:11,750 --> 00:18:10,160
present past or or active life um

457
00:18:13,990 --> 00:18:11,760
and the reason for that is that

458
00:18:15,270 --> 00:18:14,000
ultimately when you do solar systems

459
00:18:16,470 --> 00:18:15,280
exploration

460
00:18:18,070 --> 00:18:16,480
we're going to be talking about

461
00:18:20,470 --> 00:18:18,080
environments where the where an active

462
00:18:23,350 --> 00:18:20,480
biosphere could be very very deep in in

463
00:18:25,430 --> 00:18:23,360
the subsurface or or subsurface planet

464
00:18:27,350 --> 00:18:25,440
or subsurface ice or

465
00:18:30,070 --> 00:18:27,360
on an exoplanet and in in all these

466
00:18:32,150 --> 00:18:30,080
cases uh far removed from potentially

467
00:18:35,669 --> 00:18:32,160
far removed from the observation or of

468
00:18:37,350 --> 00:18:35,679
life could be fossil life where now um

469
00:18:39,830 --> 00:18:37,360
the chances of finding the chemistry

470
00:18:42,470 --> 00:18:39,840
that that fos that organism left

471
00:18:43,990 --> 00:18:42,480
billions of years ago is potentially

472
00:18:49,430 --> 00:18:44,000
more likely than finding the actual

473
00:18:49,440 --> 00:18:54,310
so we have a vote for geochemistry

474
00:18:58,710 --> 00:18:56,390
where else what else do we be should we

475
00:18:59,510 --> 00:18:58,720
be focusing on

476
00:19:00,789 --> 00:18:59,520
um

477
00:19:02,630 --> 00:19:00,799
victoria

478
00:19:04,390 --> 00:19:02,640
yeah so so i want to say you know from

479
00:19:05,909 --> 00:19:04,400
the i'm i'm in a very different field to

480
00:19:07,430 --> 00:19:05,919
chris my priorities will be different so

481
00:19:09,110 --> 00:19:07,440
i want to say from my point of view for

482
00:19:11,029 --> 00:19:09,120
extrasolar planets i think we really

483
00:19:12,870 --> 00:19:11,039
need to focus on defining new bio

484
00:19:14,230 --> 00:19:12,880
signatures um that aren't the standard

485
00:19:15,510 --> 00:19:14,240
ones associated with oxygenic

486
00:19:16,470 --> 00:19:15,520
photosynthesis

487
00:19:17,990 --> 00:19:16,480
um

488
00:19:19,909 --> 00:19:18,000
for earth-like planets orbiting sunlight

489
00:19:21,510 --> 00:19:19,919
stars that sort of kind of that that's a

490
00:19:24,150 --> 00:19:21,520
core and and maybe we can make very good

491
00:19:25,590 --> 00:19:24,160
arguments for why you know an ecosystem

492
00:19:27,510 --> 00:19:25,600
will eventually evolve to support

493
00:19:28,710 --> 00:19:27,520
photosynthesis but i think we need to

494
00:19:30,549 --> 00:19:28,720
look at these other potential

495
00:19:32,549 --> 00:19:30,559
atmospheric biosignatures as well or

496
00:19:34,150 --> 00:19:32,559
surface fire signatures because we don't

497
00:19:36,070 --> 00:19:34,160
do this then we lower our chances of

498
00:19:38,549 --> 00:19:36,080
succeeding in the search for life life

499
00:19:40,070 --> 00:19:38,559
elsewhere and we also lose sort of an

500
00:19:43,029 --> 00:19:40,080
understanding of the potential diversity

501
00:19:44,630 --> 00:19:43,039
of life and planetary systems out there

502
00:19:46,070 --> 00:19:44,640
but to do this

503
00:19:47,750 --> 00:19:46,080
what goes with this is an improved

504
00:19:49,669 --> 00:19:47,760
understanding of how biosignatures

505
00:19:51,190 --> 00:19:49,679
interact with the environment and can be

506
00:19:53,110 --> 00:19:51,200
discriminated in the context of the

507
00:19:55,190 --> 00:19:53,120
environment um

508
00:19:56,549 --> 00:19:55,200
and so so i think that study as well

509
00:19:58,150 --> 00:19:56,559
will probably inform all these this

510
00:19:59,750 --> 00:19:58,160
other biosignature research as well

511
00:20:01,590 --> 00:19:59,760
which looks at again you know life

512
00:20:03,430 --> 00:20:01,600
leaving its imprint on on a planetary

513
00:20:06,950 --> 00:20:03,440
environment whether it be on mars or

514
00:20:10,710 --> 00:20:06,960
europa or wherever

515
00:20:12,070 --> 00:20:10,720
out of curiosity have we found anything

516
00:20:13,590 --> 00:20:12,080
that would

517
00:20:15,510 --> 00:20:13,600
indicate

518
00:20:17,510 --> 00:20:15,520
alternative um and i know i'm being

519
00:20:22,310 --> 00:20:17,520
slightly self-indulgent here but

520
00:20:27,110 --> 00:20:24,870
what i'm talking about here is uh

521
00:20:28,630 --> 00:20:27,120
looking at uh you might not think of it

522
00:20:30,630 --> 00:20:28,640
so much an alternative signature but an

523
00:20:32,470 --> 00:20:30,640
alternative dominance so for example you

524
00:20:34,870 --> 00:20:32,480
could have a biosphere that's dominated

525
00:20:36,149 --> 00:20:34,880
by sulfur metabolizing bacteria for

526
00:20:37,590 --> 00:20:36,159
example and that will produce a very

527
00:20:39,990 --> 00:20:37,600
different signature in the atmosphere

528
00:20:42,310 --> 00:20:40,000
than say oxygenic

529
00:20:44,950 --> 00:20:42,320
oxygenic photosynthesis from plants so i

530
00:20:46,470 --> 00:20:44,960
think we can certainly look at

531
00:20:50,230 --> 00:20:46,480
different metabolic

532
00:20:52,310 --> 00:20:50,240
and how those interact with the planet's

533
00:20:53,990 --> 00:20:52,320
environment and also the light that's

534
00:20:55,270 --> 00:20:54,000
coming in from its parent star because

535
00:20:56,950 --> 00:20:55,280
if the light from the parent star

536
00:20:58,230 --> 00:20:56,960
changes that changes the photochemistry

537
00:21:00,070 --> 00:20:58,240
in the atmosphere and it changes what

538
00:21:01,669 --> 00:21:00,080
kind of signature you get so these

539
00:21:03,110 --> 00:21:01,679
alternative bio signatures are kind of a

540
00:21:05,190 --> 00:21:03,120
function of three different steps you

541
00:21:06,870 --> 00:21:05,200
know alternative metabolism dominant

542
00:21:09,590 --> 00:21:06,880
metabolism making them

543
00:21:12,070 --> 00:21:09,600
their their uh journey within their own

544
00:21:13,430 --> 00:21:12,080
atmosphere and and how they're um

545
00:21:14,789 --> 00:21:13,440
affected by the light from their

546
00:21:16,470 --> 00:21:14,799
different parent star in a different

547
00:21:18,070 --> 00:21:16,480
atmosphere for example and then

548
00:21:21,029 --> 00:21:18,080
ultimately what we might see in the

549
00:21:23,029 --> 00:21:21,039
spectrum for these things

550
00:21:24,710 --> 00:21:23,039
thanks okay

551
00:21:26,070 --> 00:21:24,720
i'll add a bit to what chris and vicky

552
00:21:27,190 --> 00:21:26,080
both have said

553
00:21:28,870 --> 00:21:27,200
because i think they're talking about

554
00:21:31,430 --> 00:21:28,880
different sides of the same coin they're

555
00:21:32,630 --> 00:21:31,440
they're in each case uh talking about

556
00:21:34,870 --> 00:21:32,640
features

557
00:21:36,950 --> 00:21:34,880
that are product of life processes but

558
00:21:38,630 --> 00:21:36,960
not the life itself

559
00:21:40,789 --> 00:21:38,640
and in both cases i think the real

560
00:21:42,870 --> 00:21:40,799
concern is understanding you know

561
00:21:45,350 --> 00:21:42,880
because these are features that that

562
00:21:47,909 --> 00:21:45,360
might well arise from non-living

563
00:21:48,950 --> 00:21:47,919
processes as well and features that

564
00:21:51,110 --> 00:21:48,960
inherently

565
00:21:52,390 --> 00:21:51,120
don't contain a huge amount of specific

566
00:21:54,470 --> 00:21:52,400
information

567
00:21:56,549 --> 00:21:54,480
um there's a danger in mistaking them

568
00:21:58,630 --> 00:21:56,559
for for you know in getting false

569
00:22:00,470 --> 00:21:58,640
positives i think from abiotic processes

570
00:22:03,110 --> 00:22:00,480
and so i think for

571
00:22:04,630 --> 00:22:03,120
uh for features that are are

572
00:22:06,789 --> 00:22:04,640
meant to serve as evidence of life

573
00:22:08,630 --> 00:22:06,799
processes but not life itself

574
00:22:09,990 --> 00:22:08,640
i think there's an an important standard

575
00:22:11,669 --> 00:22:10,000
that sort of has to be met you know when

576
00:22:13,750 --> 00:22:11,679
does that feature rise to the level of

577
00:22:15,669 --> 00:22:13,760
saying okay this is this is different

578
00:22:18,470 --> 00:22:15,679
enough that although it's not life

579
00:22:20,149 --> 00:22:18,480
itself we can't envision it uh having

580
00:22:22,310 --> 00:22:20,159
come from from

581
00:22:23,590 --> 00:22:22,320
anything other than life processes so i

582
00:22:25,350 --> 00:22:23,600
think it's a question of degree when we

583
00:22:26,549 --> 00:22:25,360
talk about these features

584
00:22:28,870 --> 00:22:26,559
and then on the other hand when you do

585
00:22:30,789 --> 00:22:28,880
go looking for for the life itself or

586
00:22:32,950 --> 00:22:30,799
for molecules or features

587
00:22:35,270 --> 00:22:32,960
uh that may be a product of life i think

588
00:22:37,590 --> 00:22:35,280
there's a different concern and that is

589
00:22:39,750 --> 00:22:37,600
you know we understand how to recognize

590
00:22:41,750 --> 00:22:39,760
something as specific as the molecules

591
00:22:43,430 --> 00:22:41,760
of our own biochemistry but there's a

592
00:22:45,510 --> 00:22:43,440
danger then and going looking for those

593
00:22:46,789 --> 00:22:45,520
specific molecules or features something

594
00:22:49,510 --> 00:22:46,799
like them so

595
00:22:50,870 --> 00:22:49,520
how do you how do you understand um how

596
00:22:52,149 --> 00:22:50,880
to look for a very specific thing

597
00:22:53,350 --> 00:22:52,159
something that does carry so much

598
00:22:55,190 --> 00:22:53,360
information that it's a clear

599
00:22:56,950 --> 00:22:55,200
representative of life

600
00:22:59,110 --> 00:22:56,960
but is not in the specific line that our

601
00:23:00,390 --> 00:22:59,120
biochemistry is chosen

602
00:23:03,990 --> 00:23:00,400
and i think all of those are challenges

603
00:23:04,000 --> 00:23:06,470
okay

604
00:23:06,480 --> 00:23:09,750
kelsey

605
00:23:13,590 --> 00:23:11,990
looks like her video may have frozen

606
00:23:16,470 --> 00:23:13,600
right because are you still with us on

607
00:23:18,789 --> 00:23:16,480
audio can you hear me yeah

608
00:23:20,710 --> 00:23:18,799
um yeah so i

609
00:23:21,750 --> 00:23:20,720
from my bias working in the outer solar

610
00:23:23,590 --> 00:23:21,760
system

611
00:23:25,110 --> 00:23:23,600
it's kind of similar to other people i'm

612
00:23:26,310 --> 00:23:25,120
i'm basically interested in learning

613
00:23:27,669 --> 00:23:26,320
more about what we could actually

614
00:23:30,310 --> 00:23:27,679
potentially

615
00:23:32,070 --> 00:23:30,320
check for when we send spacecraft and

616
00:23:34,630 --> 00:23:32,080
really we're still at the point of we

617
00:23:36,789 --> 00:23:34,640
need to gather a lot of other basic data

618
00:23:39,110 --> 00:23:36,799
but it's still good to look forward and

619
00:23:41,190 --> 00:23:39,120
think about what would actually be able

620
00:23:44,310 --> 00:23:41,200
to be detected in these kind of

621
00:23:45,909 --> 00:23:44,320
environments um so for us it's icy moons

622
00:23:48,549 --> 00:23:45,919
um so it's very similar to what other

623
00:23:53,590 --> 00:23:51,430
so just coming back to um

624
00:23:55,350 --> 00:23:53,600
slightly more detailed questions we're

625
00:23:56,950 --> 00:23:55,360
thinking about the most important

626
00:23:59,029 --> 00:23:56,960
research

627
00:24:00,390 --> 00:23:59,039
to conduct if you

628
00:24:02,710 --> 00:24:00,400
you were given

629
00:24:05,510 --> 00:24:02,720
reasonably large amounts of money you

630
00:24:07,190 --> 00:24:05,520
had to spend it on something to move the

631
00:24:09,269 --> 00:24:07,200
field forward

632
00:24:12,390 --> 00:24:09,279
but you could only do one thing what

633
00:24:14,549 --> 00:24:12,400
what would you spend the money on kelsey

634
00:24:16,549 --> 00:24:14,559
start with you

635
00:24:18,630 --> 00:24:16,559
sure i guess it's kind of similar to my

636
00:24:19,510 --> 00:24:18,640
last answer

637
00:24:21,350 --> 00:24:19,520
but

638
00:24:23,750 --> 00:24:21,360
for us in the outer solar system we have

639
00:24:26,310 --> 00:24:23,760
some really fascinating moons that could

640
00:24:28,390 --> 00:24:26,320
definitely potentially be places life

641
00:24:30,630 --> 00:24:28,400
could exist and of course there's been

642
00:24:32,149 --> 00:24:30,640
lots of speculation about that

643
00:24:34,630 --> 00:24:32,159
just because there is liquid water in a

644
00:24:37,110 --> 00:24:34,640
lot of cases um and and other things

645
00:24:39,590 --> 00:24:37,120
that are considered necessary for life

646
00:24:42,070 --> 00:24:39,600
um so for us we would love to you know

647
00:24:44,630 --> 00:24:42,080
spend lots of money uh sending

648
00:24:46,230 --> 00:24:44,640
spacecraft out there and basically um

649
00:24:48,549 --> 00:24:46,240
even getting information about these

650
00:24:50,230 --> 00:24:48,559
surfaces we use the surface information

651
00:24:53,029 --> 00:24:50,240
to understand the interior and the

652
00:24:55,029 --> 00:24:53,039
potential environments in there

653
00:24:56,870 --> 00:24:55,039
there's places in the outer solar system

654
00:24:58,710 --> 00:24:56,880
that haven't even been imaged

655
00:25:01,990 --> 00:24:58,720
so we have a lot of work to do and

656
00:25:03,430 --> 00:25:02,000
certainly just basic you know imaging

657
00:25:06,630 --> 00:25:03,440
spectroscopy

658
00:25:07,590 --> 00:25:06,640
uh radar for subsurface imaging of ic

659
00:25:10,230 --> 00:25:07,600
worlds

660
00:25:10,950 --> 00:25:10,240
that would be great for us

661
00:25:13,430 --> 00:25:10,960
so

662
00:25:15,750 --> 00:25:13,440
is it a case that the technology that we

663
00:25:17,750 --> 00:25:15,760
have is good enough we just have to get

664
00:25:19,190 --> 00:25:17,760
it out there or are there still

665
00:25:21,430 --> 00:25:19,200
significant

666
00:25:22,789 --> 00:25:21,440
barriers in terms of resolution and this

667
00:25:25,350 --> 00:25:22,799
sort of thing

668
00:25:27,269 --> 00:25:25,360
well it depends on the the world um for

669
00:25:28,390 --> 00:25:27,279
some place like europa there's a lot of

670
00:25:31,110 --> 00:25:28,400
technology

671
00:25:33,510 --> 00:25:31,120
that hasn't been sent the last mission

672
00:25:35,029 --> 00:25:33,520
ended in the early 2000s

673
00:25:36,549 --> 00:25:35,039
so as you can imagine there's a lot that

674
00:25:38,230 --> 00:25:36,559
could be sent there

675
00:25:39,909 --> 00:25:38,240
especially something like an ice

676
00:25:41,430 --> 00:25:39,919
penetrating radar

677
00:25:43,269 --> 00:25:41,440
in other words

678
00:25:44,390 --> 00:25:43,279
some technology development does need to

679
00:25:46,470 --> 00:25:44,400
be done

680
00:25:48,310 --> 00:25:46,480
in some cases even for europa it would

681
00:25:51,830 --> 00:25:48,320
be helpful to have better

682
00:25:53,830 --> 00:25:51,840
radiation hard products

683
00:25:55,269 --> 00:25:53,840
but in some cases just to get the mass

684
00:25:57,350 --> 00:25:55,279
to the outer solar system we need some

685
00:26:00,390 --> 00:25:57,360
more creative technologies

686
00:26:02,710 --> 00:26:00,400
either for power systems or for uh

687
00:26:04,549 --> 00:26:02,720
somehow capturing uh spacecraft into

688
00:26:06,470 --> 00:26:04,559
orbit

689
00:26:08,070 --> 00:26:06,480
those both

690
00:26:09,909 --> 00:26:08,080
okay

691
00:26:13,430 --> 00:26:09,919
chris where would you spend your

692
00:26:17,269 --> 00:26:15,590
well i mean i think i've seen the chat

693
00:26:19,029 --> 00:26:17,279
room open up with everyone's favorite

694
00:26:19,750 --> 00:26:19,039
mission and there's our there are a lot

695
00:26:21,510 --> 00:26:19,760
of

696
00:26:23,990 --> 00:26:21,520
great missions that we the people have

697
00:26:26,470 --> 00:26:24,000
dreamt up and i'm going to stay agnostic

698
00:26:29,029 --> 00:26:26,480
in that debate although i will

699
00:26:30,950 --> 00:26:29,039
second kelsey's uh plea that we need to

700
00:26:32,230 --> 00:26:30,960
get back to the outer solar system

701
00:26:33,510 --> 00:26:32,240
now within the outer solar system

702
00:26:35,190 --> 00:26:33,520
there's at least three or four places

703
00:26:36,630 --> 00:26:35,200
that we need to get back to so

704
00:26:38,149 --> 00:26:36,640
so i'm going to stay neutral there in

705
00:26:40,789 --> 00:26:38,159
terms of the astrobiology budget which

706
00:26:42,870 --> 00:26:40,799
is usually not a missions budget um you

707
00:26:45,909 --> 00:26:42,880
know i think that

708
00:26:48,310 --> 00:26:45,919
we do need to be developing better

709
00:26:50,549 --> 00:26:48,320
both time-tested approaches to life

710
00:26:52,710 --> 00:26:50,559
detection and out-of-the-box approaches

711
00:26:55,669 --> 00:26:52,720
and that's not just for

712
00:26:57,269 --> 00:26:55,679
um you know rock samples that includes

713
00:26:59,110 --> 00:26:57,279
victoria's um

714
00:27:00,630 --> 00:26:59,120
plea about atmospheric signatures i

715
00:27:02,789 --> 00:27:00,640
completely agree with her

716
00:27:04,630 --> 00:27:02,799
that that you know worlds that didn't

717
00:27:06,390 --> 00:27:04,640
generate oxygen are the most likely

718
00:27:08,230 --> 00:27:06,400
worlds you can see

719
00:27:11,110 --> 00:27:08,240
and in the next if we talk about a

720
00:27:13,350 --> 00:27:11,120
decade here is our time scale that's

721
00:27:15,830 --> 00:27:13,360
that's the right time scale for starting

722
00:27:17,830 --> 00:27:15,840
to get some um

723
00:27:19,669 --> 00:27:17,840
some first data on on exoplanet

724
00:27:22,870 --> 00:27:19,679
atmospheres around red

725
00:27:25,029 --> 00:27:22,880
i mean uh sorry around red dwarfs so um

726
00:27:26,710 --> 00:27:25,039
so i i think that that's where i would

727
00:27:28,950 --> 00:27:26,720
put my embarrassingly large amount of

728
00:27:31,830 --> 00:27:28,960
money is into into

729
00:27:34,230 --> 00:27:31,840
work on metabolisms and and the

730
00:27:36,789 --> 00:27:34,240
potential signatures they would produce

731
00:27:39,669 --> 00:27:36,799
um that that might inform both the mars

732
00:27:42,230 --> 00:27:39,679
mission or the rover in 2020

733
00:27:44,070 --> 00:27:42,240
as well as as these initial exoplanet

734
00:27:45,830 --> 00:27:44,080
missions

735
00:27:47,430 --> 00:27:45,840
excellent thank you always good to know

736
00:27:48,549 --> 00:27:47,440
we won't have difficulty spending the

737
00:27:51,590 --> 00:27:48,559
money

738
00:27:53,190 --> 00:27:51,600
dory what do you want to add to it

739
00:27:54,870 --> 00:27:53,200
uh so i would pick up a theme that vicky

740
00:27:56,389 --> 00:27:54,880
raised earlier and i i also thought it

741
00:27:57,750 --> 00:27:56,399
was kind of interesting that that i

742
00:27:59,590 --> 00:27:57,760
don't think you'd finish speaking that

743
00:28:02,230 --> 00:27:59,600
sentence before mission uh wishes

744
00:28:03,510 --> 00:28:02,240
started to pop up in the in the chat but

745
00:28:05,510 --> 00:28:03,520
i mean suppose that that thing could

746
00:28:07,750 --> 00:28:05,520
launch tomorrow do we feel like we have

747
00:28:08,630 --> 00:28:07,760
the the context from observation and

748
00:28:10,230 --> 00:28:08,640
theory

749
00:28:12,230 --> 00:28:10,240
uh to say exactly what instruments

750
00:28:13,350 --> 00:28:12,240
should go on that spacecraft and to be

751
00:28:16,470 --> 00:28:13,360
sure that

752
00:28:18,549 --> 00:28:16,480
having spent the money uh whatever we

753
00:28:19,909 --> 00:28:18,559
see you know that that

754
00:28:21,350 --> 00:28:19,919
we knew a clear signature that we were

755
00:28:22,630 --> 00:28:21,360
looking for um do we understand enough

756
00:28:25,029 --> 00:28:22,640
about the context in which that

757
00:28:27,350 --> 00:28:25,039
signature is formed uh that we could do

758
00:28:28,630 --> 00:28:27,360
a good concrete job of saying you know

759
00:28:29,990 --> 00:28:28,640
you spent the money and here's the

760
00:28:31,750 --> 00:28:30,000
answer

761
00:28:34,389 --> 00:28:31,760
so i think that that money to go into

762
00:28:35,590 --> 00:28:34,399
the sorts of of um things that vicky was

763
00:28:37,110 --> 00:28:35,600
talking about earlier you know

764
00:28:38,470 --> 00:28:37,120
understanding the the environmental

765
00:28:39,590 --> 00:28:38,480
context how is it that what you're

766
00:28:41,669 --> 00:28:39,600
looking for

767
00:28:43,430 --> 00:28:41,679
interacts with its host environment uh

768
00:28:46,230 --> 00:28:43,440
in ways that may give you false positive

769
00:28:47,430 --> 00:28:46,240
or erase a positive signature

770
00:28:50,230 --> 00:28:47,440
are critical and that is within the

771
00:28:51,990 --> 00:28:50,240
scope of astrobiology

772
00:28:55,430 --> 00:28:52,000
and is that something we can quite

773
00:28:57,350 --> 00:28:55,440
happily do on earth can we simulate it

774
00:28:59,669 --> 00:28:57,360
throw large enough computers at it is it

775
00:29:01,190 --> 00:28:59,679
that kind of problem or have we got to

776
00:29:02,710 --> 00:29:01,200
go to ground truth

777
00:29:04,149 --> 00:29:02,720
out there

778
00:29:07,190 --> 00:29:04,159
i think it's a mixture of things i i

779
00:29:09,190 --> 00:29:07,200
think it's an iteration between uh

780
00:29:10,389 --> 00:29:09,200
between theory and modeling between

781
00:29:13,590 --> 00:29:10,399
observations that can be done in

782
00:29:15,110 --> 00:29:13,600
environments here that may not be uh

783
00:29:16,549 --> 00:29:15,120
perfect examples of what we're looking

784
00:29:18,070 --> 00:29:16,559
at elsewhere but

785
00:29:20,630 --> 00:29:18,080
you know but in which we can identify

786
00:29:22,230 --> 00:29:20,640
some features that make them similar

787
00:29:23,750 --> 00:29:22,240
and then whatever we're able to do with

788
00:29:25,190 --> 00:29:23,760
with observations that may not be

789
00:29:27,669 --> 00:29:25,200
specifically targeted at the life

790
00:29:29,430 --> 00:29:27,679
question but nonetheless give us enough

791
00:29:31,590 --> 00:29:29,440
contextual information about the

792
00:29:34,230 --> 00:29:31,600
potential target that we understand

793
00:29:35,830 --> 00:29:34,240
better how it is that that our ultimate

794
00:29:38,830 --> 00:29:35,840
signature of life is going to interact

795
00:29:44,070 --> 00:29:41,750
great well vicki seeing as everyone is

796
00:29:45,190 --> 00:29:44,080
name-checking you let me come back to

797
00:29:49,029 --> 00:29:45,200
you

798
00:29:51,029 --> 00:29:49,039
well where am i going to spend i mean

799
00:29:52,870 --> 00:29:51,039
truly truly embarrassingly large amounts

800
00:29:54,549 --> 00:29:52,880
of money would go on tpf but we don't

801
00:29:55,909 --> 00:29:54,559
have that kind of money so

802
00:29:58,470 --> 00:29:55,919
so again um you know from the

803
00:30:00,870 --> 00:29:58,480
astrobiology perspective i absolutely

804
00:30:02,470 --> 00:30:00,880
agree you know i i put forward this sort

805
00:30:04,070 --> 00:30:02,480
of mean that we need these novel bio

806
00:30:06,310 --> 00:30:04,080
signatures i agree with tori we need to

807
00:30:07,110 --> 00:30:06,320
know about false positives but it's not

808
00:30:08,789 --> 00:30:07,120
just

809
00:30:10,950 --> 00:30:08,799
so that we can interpret the data when

810
00:30:12,149 --> 00:30:10,960
it comes back to to lay that solid

811
00:30:14,070 --> 00:30:12,159
scientific foundation for the

812
00:30:15,190 --> 00:30:14,080
interpretation of our search for life

813
00:30:17,190 --> 00:30:15,200
elsewhere which i think of course is

814
00:30:18,789 --> 00:30:17,200
fundamental to astrobiology but it's

815
00:30:20,789 --> 00:30:18,799
also to drive the design of those

816
00:30:23,029 --> 00:30:20,799
missions as well and i think that must

817
00:30:25,110 --> 00:30:23,039
not be forgotten that sort of the more

818
00:30:26,630 --> 00:30:25,120
we know about the the different types of

819
00:30:28,549 --> 00:30:26,640
things we'll be looking for the better

820
00:30:29,830 --> 00:30:28,559
case we'll have for driving sort of the

821
00:30:31,750 --> 00:30:29,840
requirements whether it be large

822
00:30:33,190 --> 00:30:31,760
spectral wavelengths or high special

823
00:30:35,350 --> 00:30:33,200
resolution or whatever that we will

824
00:30:37,909 --> 00:30:35,360
require to measure these things so i

825
00:30:39,590 --> 00:30:37,919
think that's also crucial as to to know

826
00:30:41,029 --> 00:30:39,600
as much as possible beforehand so we can

827
00:30:43,430 --> 00:30:41,039
build the best possible instruments to

828
00:30:44,310 --> 00:30:43,440
do the measurements

829
00:30:46,149 --> 00:30:44,320
so

830
00:30:47,830 --> 00:30:46,159
in that case in in my mind given very

831
00:30:50,470 --> 00:30:47,840
limited understanding this sort of

832
00:30:53,750 --> 00:30:50,480
segues on perhaps to our last question

833
00:30:56,389 --> 00:30:53,760
then about defining a habitable

834
00:30:57,590 --> 00:30:56,399
environment

835
00:31:00,630 --> 00:30:57,600
so

836
00:31:03,509 --> 00:31:00,640
let me ask you to unmute yourself again

837
00:31:06,389 --> 00:31:03,519
vicky for a moment and just think about

838
00:31:08,230 --> 00:31:06,399
what is it we need to do is it a natural

839
00:31:09,590 --> 00:31:08,240
segue from what you said in order to be

840
00:31:11,269 --> 00:31:09,600
able to define

841
00:31:13,590 --> 00:31:11,279
research and define the habitable

842
00:31:15,110 --> 00:31:13,600
environments

843
00:31:17,830 --> 00:31:15,120
yeah that's that's certainly part of it

844
00:31:19,590 --> 00:31:17,840
it falls into um this idea of being able

845
00:31:21,269 --> 00:31:19,600
to look at something and in my case

846
00:31:23,029 --> 00:31:21,279
again i'll speak for extrasolar planets

847
00:31:24,470 --> 00:31:23,039
but this is true of remote sensing of

848
00:31:28,070 --> 00:31:24,480
anybody in the solar system including

849
00:31:29,830 --> 00:31:28,080
icy moons or mars but being able to to

850
00:31:31,990 --> 00:31:29,840
get information from an environment and

851
00:31:34,230 --> 00:31:32,000
determine whether or not it is habitable

852
00:31:35,669 --> 00:31:34,240
and i think uh you know first off you

853
00:31:38,149 --> 00:31:35,679
know back to the biology we need to

854
00:31:39,430 --> 00:31:38,159
understand life's limitations um and we

855
00:31:41,350 --> 00:31:39,440
need to understand not only life's

856
00:31:43,110 --> 00:31:41,360
limitations but in the case of

857
00:31:45,269 --> 00:31:43,120
exoplanets or different environments how

858
00:31:46,470 --> 00:31:45,279
those limitations might be affected by

859
00:31:48,710 --> 00:31:46,480
by that environment

860
00:31:50,470 --> 00:31:48,720
so a specific example for example is you

861
00:31:52,149 --> 00:31:50,480
know how far can we go with oxygenic

862
00:31:54,389 --> 00:31:52,159
photosynthesis as far as the wavelength

863
00:31:56,310 --> 00:31:54,399
of light that's required and and how

864
00:31:59,029 --> 00:31:56,320
would that light environment change on a

865
00:32:00,310 --> 00:31:59,039
planet around another star um but this

866
00:32:02,070 --> 00:32:00,320
this question sort of feeds into the

867
00:32:03,669 --> 00:32:02,080
main issue which is an improved

868
00:32:05,509 --> 00:32:03,679
understanding of the interaction between

869
00:32:07,909 --> 00:32:05,519
planetary characteristics you know what

870
00:32:09,110 --> 00:32:07,919
the planets like stellar characteristics

871
00:32:10,870 --> 00:32:09,120
what the stars like and how that

872
00:32:12,950 --> 00:32:10,880
interacts with the planet and then the

873
00:32:14,470 --> 00:32:12,960
interaction of other objects in the

874
00:32:17,350 --> 00:32:14,480
planetary system

875
00:32:19,269 --> 00:32:17,360
so for us habitability is really a huge

876
00:32:21,509 --> 00:32:19,279
field where we're trying to

877
00:32:23,430 --> 00:32:21,519
sort of um get beyond the classical

878
00:32:25,509 --> 00:32:23,440
habitable zone and understand which is

879
00:32:27,350 --> 00:32:25,519
which is a great formalism to start with

880
00:32:30,389 --> 00:32:27,360
but to understand all the different

881
00:32:32,870 --> 00:32:30,399
factors that now affect that um

882
00:32:34,549 --> 00:32:32,880
and so in that sense if we if we know

883
00:32:36,389 --> 00:32:34,559
where the habitable zone is or can

884
00:32:38,789 --> 00:32:36,399
constrain it for the highest probability

885
00:32:40,950 --> 00:32:38,799
then that allows us to target the sort

886
00:32:42,230 --> 00:32:40,960
of planets that we want to search for

887
00:32:44,389 --> 00:32:42,240
and the sort of planets that we want to

888
00:32:45,669 --> 00:32:44,399
follow up with with instrumentation

889
00:32:48,070 --> 00:32:45,679
because those observations are going to

890
00:32:49,909 --> 00:32:48,080
be extremely expensive so so in summary

891
00:32:51,350 --> 00:32:49,919
i need to understand limitations i need

892
00:32:53,830 --> 00:32:51,360
to understand the interplay of all the

893
00:32:55,430 --> 00:32:53,840
components that go towards habitability

894
00:32:57,269 --> 00:32:55,440
i need to get that habitable zone

895
00:32:59,350 --> 00:32:57,279
defined so i know where to look and i

896
00:33:02,470 --> 00:32:59,360
know how to prioritize my targets to to

897
00:33:04,149 --> 00:33:02,480
look more at

898
00:33:06,630 --> 00:33:04,159
thank you and i'm just going to ask you

899
00:33:10,149 --> 00:33:06,640
to define one term because i noticed it

900
00:33:11,909 --> 00:33:10,159
popped up in the chat window tpf

901
00:33:14,630 --> 00:33:11,919
oh yes sorry so that's terrestrial

902
00:33:17,430 --> 00:33:14,640
planet finder it's a sort of flagship

903
00:33:19,509 --> 00:33:17,440
mission class uh probably even larger if

904
00:33:21,269 --> 00:33:19,519
there is such a thing uh mission that

905
00:33:22,950 --> 00:33:21,279
will be a very very large telescope that

906
00:33:24,710 --> 00:33:22,960
will allow us to get spectra of

907
00:33:27,029 --> 00:33:24,720
extrasolar planets orbiting around other

908
00:33:29,110 --> 00:33:27,039
stars and therefore allow us to directly

909
00:33:30,870 --> 00:33:29,120
um sample and study their environments

910
00:33:32,789 --> 00:33:30,880
remotely

911
00:33:34,389 --> 00:33:32,799
brilliant thank you

912
00:33:37,110 --> 00:33:34,399
sounds like the sort of thing one might

913
00:33:38,950 --> 00:33:37,120
spend money on large amounts sorry

914
00:33:40,389 --> 00:33:38,960
back to this question about the research

915
00:33:42,789 --> 00:33:40,399
that needs to be done to define

916
00:33:44,870 --> 00:33:42,799
inhabitable environments

917
00:33:47,110 --> 00:33:44,880
yeah i guess i would toss out two things

918
00:33:50,470 --> 00:33:47,120
in regard to this question and the first

919
00:33:51,590 --> 00:33:50,480
is i think that uh we can and should do

920
00:33:53,590 --> 00:33:51,600
more

921
00:33:55,269 --> 00:33:53,600
in order to understand when when we look

922
00:33:57,669 --> 00:33:55,279
at life on earth and take it as an

923
00:33:59,909 --> 00:33:57,679
example or a basis for for defining

924
00:34:01,830 --> 00:33:59,919
habitability i think we should do a

925
00:34:03,430 --> 00:34:01,840
better job of understanding which of the

926
00:34:05,190 --> 00:34:03,440
features the limitations the

927
00:34:07,110 --> 00:34:05,200
capabilities we're seeing

928
00:34:09,030 --> 00:34:07,120
relate to core properties of life and

929
00:34:10,950 --> 00:34:09,040
which are specific choices of our kind

930
00:34:12,710 --> 00:34:10,960
of life and our kind of biochemistry so

931
00:34:14,710 --> 00:34:12,720
in other words i think we should make

932
00:34:16,550 --> 00:34:14,720
the best use of the example we have by

933
00:34:19,190 --> 00:34:16,560
saying you know characteristics a b and

934
00:34:20,790 --> 00:34:19,200
c we can expect to be fairly universal

935
00:34:22,790 --> 00:34:20,800
for whatever reason

936
00:34:24,629 --> 00:34:22,800
but these other features of life are are

937
00:34:27,190 --> 00:34:24,639
such specific choices that that we

938
00:34:28,790 --> 00:34:27,200
really shouldn't feel too tied to them

939
00:34:31,510 --> 00:34:28,800
as we try to understand habitability

940
00:34:34,069 --> 00:34:31,520
elsewhere so i think defining better

941
00:34:36,149 --> 00:34:34,079
what is a core set of features for life

942
00:34:38,149 --> 00:34:36,159
in order to understand and define what

943
00:34:39,909 --> 00:34:38,159
is core habitability

944
00:34:43,190 --> 00:34:39,919
important the other thing that i would

945
00:34:45,030 --> 00:34:43,200
point to is i think that habitability um

946
00:34:47,030 --> 00:34:45,040
at least as it's been defined on paper

947
00:34:48,470 --> 00:34:47,040
has been largely a sort of binary

948
00:34:50,950 --> 00:34:48,480
concept either an environment is

949
00:34:53,349 --> 00:34:50,960
habitable or it's not

950
00:34:55,990 --> 00:34:53,359
in the happy event that that we're

951
00:34:58,390 --> 00:34:56,000
presented with a number of targets for

952
00:35:00,230 --> 00:34:58,400
conservation

953
00:35:02,710 --> 00:35:00,240
any of which might conceivably be called

954
00:35:04,710 --> 00:35:02,720
habitable in a binary sense life could

955
00:35:06,790 --> 00:35:04,720
conceivably exist there how do you

956
00:35:08,390 --> 00:35:06,800
prioritize among them how do you say

957
00:35:09,990 --> 00:35:08,400
that one environment is more habitable

958
00:35:12,150 --> 00:35:10,000
than another represents a better choice

959
00:35:13,349 --> 00:35:12,160
for observation may have a better signal

960
00:35:15,349 --> 00:35:13,359
to noise

961
00:35:17,670 --> 00:35:15,359
when you ultimately go looking and

962
00:35:19,270 --> 00:35:17,680
that's something that that i think maybe

963
00:35:21,430 --> 00:35:19,280
we all have notions about but that we

964
00:35:23,190 --> 00:35:21,440
haven't really tackled in a very

965
00:35:24,550 --> 00:35:23,200
concrete way yet

966
00:35:26,870 --> 00:35:24,560
so those would be the two things that i

967
00:35:30,870 --> 00:35:26,880
i think represent areas for progress at

968
00:35:34,630 --> 00:35:30,880
least when we talk about habitability

969
00:35:34,640 --> 00:35:37,510
yep

970
00:35:40,630 --> 00:35:38,630
thoughts on

971
00:35:44,790 --> 00:35:40,640
defining the research that we need to

972
00:35:49,349 --> 00:35:44,800
define habitable environments

973
00:35:54,310 --> 00:35:51,990
yeah let me think i think we

974
00:35:55,990 --> 00:35:54,320
we need to

975
00:35:58,390 --> 00:35:56,000
be careful here you know in the past

976
00:35:59,829 --> 00:35:58,400
we've been rather comfortable

977
00:36:01,990 --> 00:35:59,839
we've been rather

978
00:36:04,310 --> 00:36:02,000
comfortable to stay within our

979
00:36:06,550 --> 00:36:04,320
our comfort zone defined by

980
00:36:09,030 --> 00:36:06,560
by life on earth and we push that

981
00:36:11,829 --> 00:36:09,040
boundary to extreme environments and

982
00:36:14,470 --> 00:36:11,839
and we should continue to do that

983
00:36:16,710 --> 00:36:14,480
deep subsurface and high temperature and

984
00:36:18,870 --> 00:36:16,720
cold temperature

985
00:36:21,030 --> 00:36:18,880
alkaline and acidic and all the various

986
00:36:21,990 --> 00:36:21,040
various ways to approach that problem

987
00:36:23,670 --> 00:36:22,000
but

988
00:36:26,390 --> 00:36:23,680
you know since this topic

989
00:36:28,630 --> 00:36:26,400
this particular week is devoted to ex

990
00:36:29,910 --> 00:36:28,640
solar system exploration or systems

991
00:36:31,829 --> 00:36:29,920
exploration

992
00:36:34,230 --> 00:36:31,839
i think that you know we need to also

993
00:36:36,150 --> 00:36:34,240
recognize that that um

994
00:36:37,510 --> 00:36:36,160
we need to push that comfort zone beyond

995
00:36:38,950 --> 00:36:37,520
what ever

996
00:36:40,550 --> 00:36:38,960
occurred on earth

997
00:36:43,190 --> 00:36:40,560
to to what didn't occur on earth but

998
00:36:45,109 --> 00:36:43,200
could have occurred elsewhere um

999
00:36:46,790 --> 00:36:45,119
and so that's going to going to mean

1000
00:36:48,310 --> 00:36:46,800
that we need to spend a little more time

1001
00:36:51,030 --> 00:36:48,320
on on

1002
00:36:53,670 --> 00:36:51,040
what sometimes it's called weird life um

1003
00:36:55,430 --> 00:36:53,680
different solvents and

1004
00:36:57,030 --> 00:36:55,440
and different ways that life might have

1005
00:36:58,470 --> 00:36:57,040
formed when you start to talk about

1006
00:36:59,750 --> 00:36:58,480
about uh plants

1007
00:37:03,190 --> 00:36:59,760
and moons that are very different than

1008
00:37:06,310 --> 00:37:03,990
okay

1009
00:37:08,870 --> 00:37:06,320
thank you kelsey anything you want to

1010
00:37:11,190 --> 00:37:08,880
add on this well yeah it's kind of

1011
00:37:13,430 --> 00:37:11,200
similar to um my answer to

1012
00:37:15,910 --> 00:37:13,440
what was the last question but um yeah i

1013
00:37:17,829 --> 00:37:15,920
was thinking very similar to uh sort of

1014
00:37:20,230 --> 00:37:17,839
what other people said there's the two

1015
00:37:22,230 --> 00:37:20,240
aspects being like what you know besides

1016
00:37:23,910 --> 00:37:22,240
life as we know it what are the extremes

1017
00:37:26,230 --> 00:37:23,920
and that's really helpful for other

1018
00:37:27,990 --> 00:37:26,240
places in the solar system uh but also

1019
00:37:29,670 --> 00:37:28,000
understanding the other places

1020
00:37:30,950 --> 00:37:29,680
so it just to me it's the same as

1021
00:37:33,589 --> 00:37:30,960
everyone has said there's kind of those

1022
00:37:36,310 --> 00:37:33,599
two coming at it from both directions

1023
00:37:41,109 --> 00:37:36,320
the environment elsewhere and also what

1024
00:37:47,589 --> 00:37:43,910
oh sorry

1025
00:37:50,870 --> 00:37:47,599
oh there's a slight video lag there um

1026
00:37:52,950 --> 00:37:50,880
let me in that case just uh just direct

1027
00:37:54,790 --> 00:37:52,960
your attention i'm hoping all of our

1028
00:37:57,190 --> 00:37:54,800
panelists can see the little panel

1029
00:37:59,109 --> 00:37:57,200
called live notes too

1030
00:38:02,870 --> 00:37:59,119
because what we've been talking stavros

1031
00:38:04,710 --> 00:38:02,880
has been culling from the the chat room

1032
00:38:05,750 --> 00:38:04,720
um and it seems as though there are

1033
00:38:08,870 --> 00:38:05,760
there are several people who are

1034
00:38:09,990 --> 00:38:08,880
interested in places other than icy

1035
00:38:10,950 --> 00:38:10,000
moons

1036
00:38:13,510 --> 00:38:10,960
um

1037
00:38:16,310 --> 00:38:13,520
and i was curious ah

1038
00:38:17,589 --> 00:38:16,320
are extreme environments on earth

1039
00:38:20,390 --> 00:38:17,599
or mars

1040
00:38:23,430 --> 00:38:20,400
are they equally useful for us or

1041
00:38:26,790 --> 00:38:23,440
in order to understand habitability and

1042
00:38:28,230 --> 00:38:26,800
the identifying extraterrestrial life

1043
00:38:29,510 --> 00:38:28,240
sorry chris

1044
00:38:31,030 --> 00:38:29,520
yeah i think you know i noticed that

1045
00:38:33,109 --> 00:38:31,040
comment and you know if you if you look

1046
00:38:34,550 --> 00:38:33,119
at our the the

1047
00:38:36,950 --> 00:38:34,560
the research that the people on the

1048
00:38:39,190 --> 00:38:36,960
panel do i think that really

1049
00:38:40,390 --> 00:38:39,200
it's it's actually balanced and tori

1050
00:38:42,630 --> 00:38:40,400
tori and i

1051
00:38:43,829 --> 00:38:42,640
uh work on on microbial life and you

1052
00:38:46,550 --> 00:38:43,839
know extreme environments and weird

1053
00:38:49,430 --> 00:38:46,560
metabolisms and weird places on earth

1054
00:38:51,270 --> 00:38:49,440
that is really very um

1055
00:38:53,910 --> 00:38:51,280
focused on planets

1056
00:38:55,190 --> 00:38:53,920
um where kelsey and victoria

1057
00:38:58,150 --> 00:38:55,200
um

1058
00:39:00,870 --> 00:38:58,160
are more on icy icy moons and exoplanets

1059
00:39:02,069 --> 00:39:00,880
respectively so so you know i i'm sorry

1060
00:39:03,109 --> 00:39:02,079
that it came across that way but

1061
00:39:05,589 --> 00:39:03,119
certainly that was the flow of the

1062
00:39:08,069 --> 00:39:05,599
discussion not necessarily the bias of

1063
00:39:09,910 --> 00:39:08,079
the panel and hopefully as we open this

1064
00:39:12,150 --> 00:39:09,920
up for the next 30 minutes

1065
00:39:14,069 --> 00:39:12,160
we can have a lot of discussion about

1066
00:39:16,150 --> 00:39:14,079
about solar system targets other than

1067
00:39:18,550 --> 00:39:16,160
icy moons and exoplanets uh certainly

1068
00:39:20,950 --> 00:39:18,560
the mars program um

1069
00:39:24,630 --> 00:39:20,960
it should be discussed as well as well

1070
00:39:30,390 --> 00:39:27,750
so that seems like a good segway to open

1071
00:39:31,349 --> 00:39:30,400
it up now um

1072
00:39:33,109 --> 00:39:31,359
mike

1073
00:39:36,069 --> 00:39:33,119
we might need your help here i know

1074
00:39:37,430 --> 00:39:36,079
people can raise their hands

1075
00:39:39,750 --> 00:39:37,440
do you then

1076
00:39:42,790 --> 00:39:39,760
turn on their mics what seems to work

1077
00:39:44,470 --> 00:39:42,800
best as our approach here so um all the

1078
00:39:45,829 --> 00:39:44,480
mics are open but if you want to do the

1079
00:39:47,430 --> 00:39:45,839
raised hand

1080
00:39:48,790 --> 00:39:47,440
as a form of protocol just so people

1081
00:39:50,069 --> 00:39:48,800
don't talk over each other that could be

1082
00:39:51,670 --> 00:39:50,079
helpful

1083
00:39:53,430 --> 00:39:51,680
so if people want to do that there's an

1084
00:39:54,630 --> 00:39:53,440
icon at the top of your screen with the

1085
00:39:55,430 --> 00:39:54,640
person who looks like they're raising

1086
00:39:56,950 --> 00:39:55,440
their

1087
00:39:58,790 --> 00:39:56,960
if you click that and say raise hand

1088
00:40:01,670 --> 00:39:58,800
will know that you want to speak up and

1089
00:40:07,109 --> 00:40:04,470
so likes are now open

1090
00:40:10,550 --> 00:40:07,119
wayne first in there like a shot go

1091
00:40:14,950 --> 00:40:12,790
all right can you hear me

1092
00:40:17,750 --> 00:40:14,960
yes we can

1093
00:40:20,150 --> 00:40:17,760
okay very good um

1094
00:40:22,870 --> 00:40:20,160
yeah i was kind of the one that threw in

1095
00:40:25,910 --> 00:40:22,880
the comment about uh possible skewing of

1096
00:40:29,109 --> 00:40:25,920
the panel and i i don't i didn't mean to

1097
00:40:31,430 --> 00:40:29,119
offend anybody i i just wanted to uh

1098
00:40:33,270 --> 00:40:31,440
bring the discussion a little back

1099
00:40:36,069 --> 00:40:33,280
towards something that we have quite a

1100
00:40:36,829 --> 00:40:36,079
bit more ground truth for um

1101
00:40:39,510 --> 00:40:36,839
you know

1102
00:40:43,109 --> 00:40:39,520
exoplanets it's a lot of observation

1103
00:40:46,550 --> 00:40:43,119
from a distance um icy icy moons we have

1104
00:40:48,630 --> 00:40:46,560
some physical and chemical data but

1105
00:40:52,230 --> 00:40:48,640
obviously landing and sampling would

1106
00:40:54,069 --> 00:40:52,240
give us a lot more data than we have

1107
00:40:56,870 --> 00:40:54,079
but at the moment we have quite a bit of

1108
00:40:59,430 --> 00:40:56,880
ground data from mars from

1109
00:41:02,309 --> 00:40:59,440
sampling of the environment not only the

1110
00:41:04,230 --> 00:41:02,319
atmospheric environment and the physical

1111
00:41:05,750 --> 00:41:04,240
temperature radiation environment but

1112
00:41:08,230 --> 00:41:05,760
also quite a bit of

1113
00:41:09,510 --> 00:41:08,240
data about the soil and the regolith

1114
00:41:11,430 --> 00:41:09,520
itself

1115
00:41:15,430 --> 00:41:11,440
and

1116
00:41:17,510 --> 00:41:15,440
this is something that we can can take

1117
00:41:19,349 --> 00:41:17,520
right into the laboratory

1118
00:41:22,790 --> 00:41:19,359
and look for

1119
00:41:24,470 --> 00:41:22,800
earth microbes which which can grow and

1120
00:41:25,829 --> 00:41:24,480
survive under those conditions and we

1121
00:41:27,750 --> 00:41:25,839
can actually

1122
00:41:30,710 --> 00:41:27,760
physically test

1123
00:41:33,030 --> 00:41:30,720
the attributes of microbial life that

1124
00:41:35,589 --> 00:41:33,040
allows them to grow in a very close

1125
00:41:36,470 --> 00:41:35,599
simulation of the martian environment

1126
00:41:38,790 --> 00:41:36,480
and

1127
00:41:41,270 --> 00:41:38,800
you know when you compare that with

1128
00:41:43,510 --> 00:41:41,280
the wealth of data we have about what's

1129
00:41:45,510 --> 00:41:43,520
underneath the surface of an icy moon or

1130
00:41:49,270 --> 00:41:45,520
what's circling a star several light

1131
00:41:51,589 --> 00:41:49,280
years away there's no comparison

1132
00:41:53,910 --> 00:41:51,599
and we're really making some some really

1133
00:41:57,030 --> 00:41:53,920
interesting strides in

1134
00:41:58,790 --> 00:41:57,040
defining what it is about a microbial

1135
00:42:01,750 --> 00:41:58,800
cell that allows it to grow at low

1136
00:42:03,829 --> 00:42:01,760
pressure or extreme low temperature

1137
00:42:05,349 --> 00:42:03,839
or in the presence of radiation or

1138
00:42:08,230 --> 00:42:05,359
strong oxidants

1139
00:42:10,309 --> 00:42:08,240
and so i wouldn't

1140
00:42:11,829 --> 00:42:10,319
i wouldn't rule out mars as somebody

1141
00:42:14,230 --> 00:42:11,839
somewhere where we've just been there

1142
00:42:15,750 --> 00:42:14,240
and done that and move on

1143
00:42:19,430 --> 00:42:15,760
i guess that's my

1144
00:42:19,440 --> 00:42:25,270
anyone want to comment on that

1145
00:42:30,550 --> 00:42:28,150
no i completely agree

1146
00:42:32,309 --> 00:42:30,560
i mean i completely agree and and uh

1147
00:42:33,670 --> 00:42:32,319
we're we're at mars we're at mars with

1148
00:42:35,829 --> 00:42:33,680
two rovers and we're going to be going

1149
00:42:38,069 --> 00:42:35,839
to mars with another rover and so

1150
00:42:40,230 --> 00:42:38,079
there's no question that uh

1151
00:42:41,990 --> 00:42:40,240
that in the short term and the medium

1152
00:42:43,829 --> 00:42:42,000
turn a lot of effort and astrobiology

1153
00:42:46,390 --> 00:42:43,839
needs to be geared toward

1154
00:42:49,030 --> 00:42:46,400
toward that particular planetary setting

1155
00:42:53,270 --> 00:42:49,040
and and that should be both for present

1156
00:42:55,430 --> 00:42:53,280
life on mars at near the surface and

1157
00:43:00,069 --> 00:42:55,440
more deeply buried life and also past

1158
00:43:06,230 --> 00:43:03,510
i i'm conscious of time so

1159
00:43:08,710 --> 00:43:06,240
at this point i'd like to ask um kenda

1160
00:43:10,390 --> 00:43:08,720
kendall lynch

1161
00:43:12,069 --> 00:43:10,400
you're mike yes i'm here can everybody

1162
00:43:13,589 --> 00:43:12,079
hear me

1163
00:43:16,470 --> 00:43:13,599
yes we can

1164
00:43:18,150 --> 00:43:16,480
great so i just wanted to address um a

1165
00:43:20,150 --> 00:43:18,160
statement that corey

1166
00:43:21,589 --> 00:43:20,160
kind of um and tori's comments about

1167
00:43:23,510 --> 00:43:21,599
habitability

1168
00:43:25,030 --> 00:43:23,520
and you know it being binary or not and

1169
00:43:26,550 --> 00:43:25,040
how do we start to prioritize because

1170
00:43:29,270 --> 00:43:26,560
clearly we have a lot of habitable

1171
00:43:30,470 --> 00:43:29,280
environments but given our known budget

1172
00:43:33,109 --> 00:43:30,480
constraints

1173
00:43:34,950 --> 00:43:33,119
um that we have and will continue to

1174
00:43:37,430 --> 00:43:34,960
have in the foreseeable future we do

1175
00:43:39,430 --> 00:43:37,440
need to prioritize and one of the things

1176
00:43:41,349 --> 00:43:39,440
that i see that we need to do more it's

1177
00:43:43,270 --> 00:43:41,359
not necessarily

1178
00:43:46,470 --> 00:43:43,280
a specific touch of a new direction of

1179
00:43:48,069 --> 00:43:46,480
research but i think it's in

1180
00:43:50,470 --> 00:43:48,079
considerating the connectivity of the

1181
00:43:52,150 --> 00:43:50,480
work that we have done and the context

1182
00:43:54,069 --> 00:43:52,160
of the environments that we've studied

1183
00:43:55,910 --> 00:43:54,079
here on earth and how they are applied

1184
00:43:58,309 --> 00:43:55,920
to

1185
00:43:59,910 --> 00:43:58,319
these other planetary environments so we

1186
00:44:02,069 --> 00:43:59,920
need to understand not only okay is an

1187
00:44:03,670 --> 00:44:02,079
environment habitable habitable

1188
00:44:05,510 --> 00:44:03,680
can it produce biosignatures but what is

1189
00:44:07,589 --> 00:44:05,520
the connectivity between it being

1190
00:44:09,270 --> 00:44:07,599
habitable both in the past and in the

1191
00:44:11,990 --> 00:44:09,280
present what is that connectivity to the

1192
00:44:13,750 --> 00:44:12,000
possibility of life originating in that

1193
00:44:15,829 --> 00:44:13,760
potential habitable environment what is

1194
00:44:17,589 --> 00:44:15,839
the what is the connectivity to that

1195
00:44:20,230 --> 00:44:17,599
environment being accessible with our

1196
00:44:22,710 --> 00:44:20,240
mission goals we need to create this

1197
00:44:24,150 --> 00:44:22,720
connectivity between these habitable

1198
00:44:26,390 --> 00:44:24,160
between these different aspects of each

1199
00:44:28,069 --> 00:44:26,400
habitable environment in that way we

1200
00:44:30,390 --> 00:44:28,079
should be able to develop a way to

1201
00:44:32,309 --> 00:44:30,400
prioritize which environments do we want

1202
00:44:33,349 --> 00:44:32,319
to target for study with our given our

1203
00:44:34,950 --> 00:44:33,359
limited

1204
00:44:36,550 --> 00:44:34,960
mission resources so that's something

1205
00:44:39,990 --> 00:44:36,560
that i think

1206
00:44:42,230 --> 00:44:40,000
astrobiologists can um participate

1207
00:44:43,670 --> 00:44:42,240
more in on the mission front because for

1208
00:44:45,109 --> 00:44:43,680
example i was just at an early mars

1209
00:44:46,630 --> 00:44:45,119
meeting and all of the mission people

1210
00:44:48,069 --> 00:44:46,640
who were almost all pure geologists or

1211
00:44:50,390 --> 00:44:48,079
planetary scientists there was a group

1212
00:44:52,390 --> 00:44:50,400
of astrobiologists there and when they

1213
00:44:54,309 --> 00:44:52,400
said hey astrobiologists where should we

1214
00:44:55,430 --> 00:44:54,319
look the answer was all over the place

1215
00:44:56,710 --> 00:44:55,440
there was no

1216
00:44:58,870 --> 00:44:56,720
coordinated

1217
00:45:00,630 --> 00:44:58,880
focused considered

1218
00:45:01,910 --> 00:45:00,640
metric of how to

1219
00:45:03,349 --> 00:45:01,920
answer that question and i think that's

1220
00:45:07,190 --> 00:45:03,359
something that we as the astrobiology

1221
00:45:09,270 --> 00:45:07,200
community need to focus on in this next

1222
00:45:11,430 --> 00:45:09,280
um in this next roadmap to make sure

1223
00:45:14,309 --> 00:45:11,440
that we can get our voices heard for our

1224
00:45:14,319 --> 00:45:17,349
i'm done

1225
00:45:21,589 --> 00:45:20,710
do you want to add anything to that

1226
00:45:23,430 --> 00:45:21,599
um

1227
00:45:24,790 --> 00:45:23,440
not so much add to what kenda said it

1228
00:45:27,270 --> 00:45:24,800
just sparked another thought for me

1229
00:45:29,829 --> 00:45:27,280
which is uh you know this this question

1230
00:45:31,670 --> 00:45:29,839
of time inhabitability is something i

1231
00:45:33,510 --> 00:45:31,680
don't think is addressed all that much

1232
00:45:35,510 --> 00:45:33,520
and in particular for me it raises an

1233
00:45:38,150 --> 00:45:35,520
issue that i usually think of it

1234
00:45:39,990 --> 00:45:38,160
uh in reference to extant life how would

1235
00:45:41,750 --> 00:45:40,000
extant life fair if dropped into this

1236
00:45:43,430 --> 00:45:41,760
environment um you know would it

1237
00:45:45,270 --> 00:45:43,440
proliferate would it barely limp along

1238
00:45:46,870 --> 00:45:45,280
but there's a second question that isn't

1239
00:45:48,870 --> 00:45:46,880
addressed quite so often

1240
00:45:50,230 --> 00:45:48,880
um and that is how conducive is an

1241
00:45:52,150 --> 00:45:50,240
environment to having life originated in

1242
00:45:53,190 --> 00:45:52,160
the first place that's a very difficult

1243
00:45:54,790 --> 00:45:53,200
question to answer because i don't think

1244
00:45:57,670 --> 00:45:54,800
we understand how that process happens

1245
00:46:00,309 --> 00:45:57,680
at all but it's a much more restrictive

1246
00:46:02,630 --> 00:46:00,319
set of conditions certainly and and so

1247
00:46:03,510 --> 00:46:02,640
trying to bring some notion of

1248
00:46:05,030 --> 00:46:03,520
time

1249
00:46:06,309 --> 00:46:05,040
and origins into the question of

1250
00:46:13,990 --> 00:46:06,319
habitability

1251
00:46:19,190 --> 00:46:17,349
just uh probably one other question

1252
00:46:21,510 --> 00:46:19,200
murphy and let's see you've got your

1253
00:46:24,790 --> 00:46:21,520
hand up

1254
00:46:26,230 --> 00:46:24,800
yeah this is the motive party jpl um

1255
00:46:28,150 --> 00:46:26,240
i think

1256
00:46:30,790 --> 00:46:28,160
one of the key differences between

1257
00:46:32,150 --> 00:46:30,800
astrobiology and biology is as i said in

1258
00:46:34,550 --> 00:46:32,160
my chart

1259
00:46:37,030 --> 00:46:34,560
uh to

1260
00:46:39,030 --> 00:46:37,040
see how far life

1261
00:46:41,190 --> 00:46:39,040
could have evolved that means the

1262
00:46:43,990 --> 00:46:41,200
prebiotic evolution as well

1263
00:46:47,190 --> 00:46:44,000
uh on other you know solar system

1264
00:46:49,030 --> 00:46:47,200
objects rather than just go and look for

1265
00:46:51,430 --> 00:46:49,040
uh whether it is habitable or whether it

1266
00:46:53,190 --> 00:46:51,440
has life or not like you know binary as

1267
00:46:55,589 --> 00:46:53,200
story was telling

1268
00:46:57,589 --> 00:46:55,599
and for that reason i think we need to

1269
00:46:58,710 --> 00:46:57,599
really focus on

1270
00:47:11,030 --> 00:46:58,720
on

1271
00:47:13,990 --> 00:47:11,040
should also get involved

1272
00:47:16,470 --> 00:47:14,000
in mission supported research but as i

1273
00:47:20,470 --> 00:47:16,480
also mentioned in my chat we should not

1274
00:47:22,230 --> 00:47:20,480
be a sub uh you know ordinate of a

1275
00:47:25,990 --> 00:47:22,240
mission because

1276
00:47:29,270 --> 00:47:26,000
uh then the independence of uh the

1277
00:47:30,870 --> 00:47:29,280
astrobiology uh you know uh research

1278
00:47:33,670 --> 00:47:30,880
will be gone

1279
00:47:37,190 --> 00:47:33,680
so though we as kendra said just now

1280
00:47:39,190 --> 00:47:37,200
that uh the the mars uh you know uh

1281
00:47:43,109 --> 00:47:39,200
community needs to know what

1282
00:47:45,589 --> 00:47:43,119
astrobiology is offering them

1283
00:47:47,030 --> 00:47:45,599
we should not become a subject of uh

1284
00:47:49,109 --> 00:47:47,040
mars uh

1285
00:47:50,630 --> 00:47:49,119
you know biological potential and things

1286
00:47:53,910 --> 00:47:50,640
like that so we should keep our

1287
00:47:56,150 --> 00:47:53,920
independence and

1288
00:47:59,349 --> 00:47:56,160
connect with the missions but our goal

1289
00:48:00,150 --> 00:47:59,359
should be actually finding the mission

1290
00:48:02,790 --> 00:48:00,160
of

1291
00:48:05,190 --> 00:48:02,800
nai as well as nasa

1292
00:48:08,870 --> 00:48:05,200
that is you know how far life has come

1293
00:48:11,750 --> 00:48:08,880
elsewhere and how can we detect it

1294
00:48:13,910 --> 00:48:13,030
thank you

1295
00:48:15,670 --> 00:48:13,920
um

1296
00:48:18,470 --> 00:48:15,680
okay it doesn't look as though anyone

1297
00:48:21,349 --> 00:48:18,480
else has their hand up at the moment i'm

1298
00:48:24,069 --> 00:48:21,359
just scrolling through my list here um

1299
00:48:26,069 --> 00:48:24,079
let me just ask the participants on on

1300
00:48:29,589 --> 00:48:26,079
the call out there

1301
00:48:32,309 --> 00:48:29,599
does anyone want to um advocate for a

1302
00:48:34,069 --> 00:48:32,319
particular area of research i'm thinking

1303
00:48:36,390 --> 00:48:34,079
particularly about the second question

1304
00:48:39,510 --> 00:48:36,400
about determine the set of criteria for

1305
00:48:41,910 --> 00:48:39,520
identifying extraterrestrial life um

1306
00:48:44,230 --> 00:48:41,920
and of course the third question as well

1307
00:48:46,309 --> 00:48:44,240
there's sort of a lot of chat i've seen

1308
00:48:50,630 --> 00:48:46,319
in the chat room does anyone want to

1309
00:48:57,910 --> 00:48:50,640
expand upon what they've said um for the

1310
00:49:03,030 --> 00:49:00,230
yeah let me let me say something so ron

1311
00:49:05,109 --> 00:49:03,040
breslow i give you am i in there or do i

1312
00:49:07,270 --> 00:49:05,119
have to press some button in order to

1313
00:49:08,710 --> 00:49:07,280
be heard you you are in you are alive

1314
00:49:10,630 --> 00:49:08,720
and direct

1315
00:49:12,309 --> 00:49:10,640
okay yeah yeah there's there's another

1316
00:49:14,630 --> 00:49:12,319
there's another part of this which is

1317
00:49:16,470 --> 00:49:14,640
fact supported by the astrobiology

1318
00:49:17,430 --> 00:49:16,480
system and which i think is quite

1319
00:49:19,589 --> 00:49:17,440
important

1320
00:49:21,430 --> 00:49:19,599
and it's it's a more it's an earlier

1321
00:49:24,150 --> 00:49:21,440
question than anybody has ever asked

1322
00:49:26,230 --> 00:49:24,160
that is how did life start here

1323
00:49:27,750 --> 00:49:26,240
and the question really comes down to

1324
00:49:29,910 --> 00:49:27,760
things like where did you get the

1325
00:49:31,589 --> 00:49:29,920
appropriate chemical environment such

1326
00:49:33,349 --> 00:49:31,599
that the chemicals were there after all

1327
00:49:35,750 --> 00:49:33,359
they can't be produced by my life it

1328
00:49:38,150 --> 00:49:35,760
comes later right so yeah where did we

1329
00:49:41,030 --> 00:49:38,160
get all the chemicals and the most most

1330
00:49:42,069 --> 00:49:41,040
curious one about our chemicals is that

1331
00:49:43,910 --> 00:49:42,079
we have

1332
00:49:46,390 --> 00:49:43,920
selective chirality and all these

1333
00:49:48,870 --> 00:49:46,400
chemicals the amino acids are what are

1334
00:49:51,589 --> 00:49:48,880
called l amino acids like your left hand

1335
00:49:53,589 --> 00:49:51,599
and the sugars are d amino d sugars like

1336
00:49:55,510 --> 00:49:53,599
your right hand and yet

1337
00:49:57,990 --> 00:49:55,520
spontaneous chemistry without life

1338
00:49:59,910 --> 00:49:58,000
around to direct it doesn't lead to that

1339
00:50:02,150 --> 00:49:59,920
kind of thing so where did he come from

1340
00:50:03,829 --> 00:50:02,160
and that's where a very exciting new

1341
00:50:06,470 --> 00:50:03,839
thing which has happened has really

1342
00:50:08,390 --> 00:50:06,480
opened up this field that is meteorites

1343
00:50:10,950 --> 00:50:08,400
landing here have arrived with some

1344
00:50:12,549 --> 00:50:10,960
excess chirality and people spend their

1345
00:50:14,150 --> 00:50:12,559
time trying to figure out where it came

1346
00:50:16,390 --> 00:50:14,160
from but what we spend our time with is

1347
00:50:18,549 --> 00:50:16,400
saying how does that then steer all the

1348
00:50:20,549 --> 00:50:18,559
chirality on earth so that you get

1349
00:50:23,309 --> 00:50:20,559
the l amino acids you need and the d

1350
00:50:25,589 --> 00:50:23,319
sugars that you need in a sensible

1351
00:50:27,750 --> 00:50:25,599
non-vital way not having nothing to do

1352
00:50:30,390 --> 00:50:27,760
with life but having to do with

1353
00:50:32,230 --> 00:50:30,400
prebiotic life getting getting it ready

1354
00:50:33,670 --> 00:50:32,240
now that means of course that it's a

1355
00:50:35,829 --> 00:50:33,680
good chance that one has to have

1356
00:50:36,950 --> 00:50:35,839
something like that going wherever life

1357
00:50:38,950 --> 00:50:36,960
is going to be it's not going to

1358
00:50:40,710 --> 00:50:38,960
suddenly appear without the chemicals

1359
00:50:41,829 --> 00:50:40,720
that comprise it

1360
00:50:44,390 --> 00:50:41,839
and of course they could be different

1361
00:50:46,870 --> 00:50:44,400
chemicals to mars but still they're very

1362
00:50:49,750 --> 00:50:46,880
unlikely to be flat chemicals which have

1363
00:50:51,990 --> 00:50:49,760
no sense of left or right it's just any

1364
00:50:54,230 --> 00:50:52,000
sensible reasonably reasonable

1365
00:50:55,030 --> 00:50:54,240
reasonable large molecule has that that

1366
00:50:57,510 --> 00:50:55,040
thing

1367
00:50:59,030 --> 00:50:57,520
and so then the question is uh one of

1368
00:51:01,270 --> 00:50:59,040
the things that's quite interesting why

1369
00:51:03,190 --> 00:51:01,280
did we end up with left rather than

1370
00:51:05,190 --> 00:51:03,200
right amino acids why do we end up with

1371
00:51:07,589 --> 00:51:05,200
right other left sugars how did that all

1372
00:51:10,309 --> 00:51:07,599
come about and is it possible that in

1373
00:51:11,750 --> 00:51:10,319
other environments it would be reversed

1374
00:51:13,670 --> 00:51:11,760
so people are quite interested in the

1375
00:51:15,109 --> 00:51:13,680
possibility that life somewhere else

1376
00:51:16,390 --> 00:51:15,119
might be the mirror image of what's

1377
00:51:19,190 --> 00:51:16,400
going on here

1378
00:51:21,349 --> 00:51:19,200
and that even finding that chirality

1379
00:51:23,430 --> 00:51:21,359
somewhere would be really exciting

1380
00:51:26,309 --> 00:51:23,440
because as i say it's not what you get

1381
00:51:29,109 --> 00:51:26,319
spontaneously except for

1382
00:51:31,349 --> 00:51:29,119
this special situation in in meteorites

1383
00:51:33,750 --> 00:51:31,359
landing here which are bringing in

1384
00:51:35,670 --> 00:51:33,760
something that was developed outside of

1385
00:51:36,790 --> 00:51:35,680
our atmosphere by uh

1386
00:51:38,390 --> 00:51:36,800
right probably right circularly

1387
00:51:41,109 --> 00:51:38,400
polarized light but even that hasn't

1388
00:51:42,549 --> 00:51:41,119
been detected and identified yet so this

1389
00:51:44,230 --> 00:51:42,559
is a lot of you know that that has to be

1390
00:51:45,829 --> 00:51:44,240
worked on but what we're doing right now

1391
00:51:47,670 --> 00:51:45,839
is just to try to figure out what

1392
00:51:50,390 --> 00:51:47,680
spontaneous chemistry can make the

1393
00:51:52,309 --> 00:51:50,400
things that are needed for dna and for

1394
00:51:54,230 --> 00:51:52,319
proteins for all the things that at

1395
00:51:56,549 --> 00:51:54,240
least in our version of life are

1396
00:51:59,510 --> 00:51:56,559
critical

1397
00:52:02,150 --> 00:51:59,520
so ron let me ask you in that case

1398
00:52:03,990 --> 00:52:02,160
i shouldn't limit uh the spending the

1399
00:52:06,150 --> 00:52:04,000
very large amounts of money just to the

1400
00:52:08,309 --> 00:52:06,160
panelists where would where would you

1401
00:52:09,589 --> 00:52:08,319
write the check if you wanted to advance

1402
00:52:11,589 --> 00:52:09,599
that

1403
00:52:13,349 --> 00:52:11,599
well i have an idea

1404
00:52:15,750 --> 00:52:13,359
well somebody i i could probably think

1405
00:52:18,309 --> 00:52:15,760
of where you would do it uh the minimum

1406
00:52:20,150 --> 00:52:18,319
thing i would like to do i have a a

1407
00:52:23,349 --> 00:52:20,160
colleague actually who has support from

1408
00:52:24,710 --> 00:52:23,359
nasa uh named amber miller she uh she

1409
00:52:27,190 --> 00:52:24,720
looks at uh

1410
00:52:30,630 --> 00:52:27,200
the light in outside our atmosphere that

1411
00:52:32,069 --> 00:52:30,640
there's a residual of the uh the

1412
00:52:34,230 --> 00:52:32,079
light that was originally emitted during

1413
00:52:36,870 --> 00:52:34,240
the big bang so it's obviously quite far

1414
00:52:39,190 --> 00:52:36,880
back from when life got around but she

1415
00:52:41,589 --> 00:52:39,200
and i would like to send up

1416
00:52:43,349 --> 00:52:41,599
an observer to uh get outside our

1417
00:52:44,870 --> 00:52:43,359
atmosphere and see whether we have in

1418
00:52:46,470 --> 00:52:44,880
fact an excess of right circular

1419
00:52:49,109 --> 00:52:46,480
polarized light which is the one that

1420
00:52:51,670 --> 00:52:49,119
really makes the most sense for why it

1421
00:52:53,510 --> 00:52:51,680
is we we have the chirality we have but

1422
00:52:54,950 --> 00:52:53,520
it's one thing to say that it must be

1423
00:52:56,790 --> 00:52:54,960
there and another thing as you know as a

1424
00:52:58,630 --> 00:52:56,800
scientist to see and sure enough there

1425
00:53:00,549 --> 00:52:58,640
it is so i would like to put it's not a

1426
00:53:02,870 --> 00:53:00,559
huge amount of money but some amount of

1427
00:53:04,710 --> 00:53:02,880
money to get to let us send up what

1428
00:53:06,150 --> 00:53:04,720
amber does she sends up a balloon to the

1429
00:53:08,549 --> 00:53:06,160
edge of the atmosphere and then she can

1430
00:53:10,549 --> 00:53:08,559
pick up the extra extra

1431
00:53:12,950 --> 00:53:10,559
atmospheric light and that's what we

1432
00:53:15,430 --> 00:53:12,960
would like to do modest but not not

1433
00:53:17,990 --> 00:53:15,440
negligible

1434
00:53:19,829 --> 00:53:18,000
excellent thank you

1435
00:53:21,910 --> 00:53:19,839
michael um

1436
00:53:27,190 --> 00:53:21,920
is there anything that you want to to

1437
00:53:31,030 --> 00:53:29,670
no i i

1438
00:53:33,430 --> 00:53:31,040
i think there's been some good

1439
00:53:37,190 --> 00:53:33,440
conversation especially especially in

1440
00:53:39,270 --> 00:53:37,200
the chat window i'm um

1441
00:53:41,190 --> 00:53:39,280
a little bit surprised that nobody's

1442
00:53:43,910 --> 00:53:41,200
jumped forward with their favorite uh

1443
00:53:46,950 --> 00:53:45,109
or

1444
00:53:48,870 --> 00:53:46,960
the discussion of what makes a

1445
00:53:51,430 --> 00:53:48,880
environment habitable

1446
00:53:55,030 --> 00:53:51,440
um since these are great topics usually

1447
00:54:00,150 --> 00:53:56,630
so i would like to know what people

1448
00:54:03,190 --> 00:54:01,430
what do we need to do to define an

1449
00:54:06,710 --> 00:54:03,200
environment as habitable you know we we

1450
00:54:07,670 --> 00:54:06,720
have this basic triad we talked about of

1451
00:54:10,309 --> 00:54:07,680
water

1452
00:54:12,710 --> 00:54:10,319
nutrients and free energy differences

1453
00:54:15,430 --> 00:54:12,720
but beyond that that's pretty other than

1454
00:54:17,430 --> 00:54:15,440
saying water it's pretty high level

1455
00:54:19,349 --> 00:54:17,440
pretty abstract in a way

1456
00:54:21,190 --> 00:54:19,359
so i would be curious to know what what

1457
00:54:27,030 --> 00:54:21,200
people think we need to actually go and

1458
00:54:35,190 --> 00:54:29,990
so it's what do we what do we have to do

1459
00:54:42,470 --> 00:54:37,109
well basically it's your third question

1460
00:54:48,870 --> 00:54:46,309
oh mercy you want to come back on that

1461
00:54:51,109 --> 00:54:48,880
yeah i just wanted to uh you know touch

1462
00:54:53,829 --> 00:54:51,119
upon mike's question but before that i

1463
00:54:56,309 --> 00:54:53,839
want to disambiguate my earlier

1464
00:54:57,270 --> 00:54:56,319
statement is saying that

1465
00:54:59,829 --> 00:54:57,280
the

1466
00:55:03,589 --> 00:54:59,839
astrobiology research should actually

1467
00:55:07,670 --> 00:55:03,599
lead and strengthen the missions and the

1468
00:55:10,630 --> 00:55:07,680
missions needs should be catered

1469
00:55:13,750 --> 00:55:10,640
partly by astrobiology research

1470
00:55:16,069 --> 00:55:13,760
but these two should not be you know

1471
00:55:17,670 --> 00:55:16,079
totally coupled together to lose the

1472
00:55:20,069 --> 00:55:17,680
independence of astrobiology research

1473
00:55:22,390 --> 00:55:20,079
okay that's my statement ellis statement

1474
00:55:24,789 --> 00:55:22,400
now coming back to michael's uh you know

1475
00:55:26,789 --> 00:55:24,799
habitability environments

1476
00:55:30,150 --> 00:55:26,799
uh i think we need to also put a

1477
00:55:33,109 --> 00:55:30,160
qualifier here saying as we

1478
00:55:35,270 --> 00:55:33,119
think of life uh in

1479
00:55:37,750 --> 00:55:35,280
in the context of earth

1480
00:55:39,670 --> 00:55:37,760
so that's a a very important thing once

1481
00:55:43,349 --> 00:55:39,680
we put that qualifier

1482
00:55:44,230 --> 00:55:43,359
then it boils down to uh as mike said a

1483
00:55:48,630 --> 00:55:44,240
few

1484
00:55:51,670 --> 00:55:48,640
key aspects one is the liquid water

1485
00:55:54,150 --> 00:55:51,680
for the mobility and then the nutrients

1486
00:55:55,030 --> 00:55:54,160
and the energy

1487
00:55:55,910 --> 00:55:55,040
and

1488
00:55:57,589 --> 00:55:55,920
the

1489
00:55:59,670 --> 00:55:57,599
electrical

1490
00:56:01,670 --> 00:55:59,680
let's say

1491
00:56:03,190 --> 00:56:01,680
dipole forces that means there should be

1492
00:56:06,230 --> 00:56:03,200
a gradient

1493
00:56:09,030 --> 00:56:06,240
so these are the uh you know

1494
00:56:11,190 --> 00:56:09,040
of course organics of course organics

1495
00:56:13,510 --> 00:56:11,200
without organics uh you know as we think

1496
00:56:16,789 --> 00:56:13,520
of life there is no life so all these

1497
00:56:17,670 --> 00:56:16,799
are the five uh you know key aspects and

1498
00:56:19,829 --> 00:56:17,680
i think

1499
00:56:23,030 --> 00:56:19,839
majority of you know the potentially

1500
00:56:25,109 --> 00:56:23,040
habitable environments on uh in our

1501
00:56:26,309 --> 00:56:25,119
solar system actually qualify for this

1502
00:56:29,510 --> 00:56:26,319
for example

1503
00:56:32,069 --> 00:56:29,520
the subsurface of titan qualifies for us

1504
00:56:34,870 --> 00:56:32,079
and subsurface of europa qualifies for

1505
00:56:37,030 --> 00:56:34,880
this and probably even mars subsurface

1506
00:56:38,549 --> 00:56:37,040
qualifies for this and even probably the

1507
00:56:41,990 --> 00:56:38,559
surface of mars

1508
00:56:43,589 --> 00:56:42,000
would have qualified earlier so i i

1509
00:56:47,190 --> 00:56:43,599
that's my you know take about the

1510
00:56:49,990 --> 00:56:47,200
habitable environments

1511
00:56:52,549 --> 00:56:50,000
thank you and with that we will draw it

1512
00:56:54,950 --> 00:56:52,559
to a close um i would just like to draw

1513
00:56:58,069 --> 00:56:54,960
everyone's attention to the website

1514
00:56:59,910 --> 00:56:58,079
which starburst has just typed up in the

1515
00:57:03,030 --> 00:56:59,920
middle chat window if you're not

1516
00:57:05,190 --> 00:57:03,040
registered on astrobiologyfuture.org

1517
00:57:07,910 --> 00:57:05,200
already please do so

1518
00:57:09,510 --> 00:57:07,920
we are now going to take

1519
00:57:10,309 --> 00:57:09,520
these questions

1520
00:57:12,710 --> 00:57:10,319
and

1521
00:57:15,510 --> 00:57:12,720
encourage you to add others you'll find

1522
00:57:17,750 --> 00:57:15,520
that there is a discussion forum

1523
00:57:20,549 --> 00:57:17,760
um we've popped up a couple of starting

1524
00:57:23,190 --> 00:57:20,559
categories one around interesting ideas

1525
00:57:25,349 --> 00:57:23,200
and the other around exciting questions

1526
00:57:27,270 --> 00:57:25,359
please don't feel constrained by those

1527
00:57:28,309 --> 00:57:27,280
if you want to start other categories do

1528
00:57:29,750 --> 00:57:28,319
so

1529
00:57:32,150 --> 00:57:29,760
but really what we're looking to do is

1530
00:57:34,470 --> 00:57:32,160
over the next week to capture any

1531
00:57:36,230 --> 00:57:34,480
thoughts that you've had as you go out

1532
00:57:37,750 --> 00:57:36,240
walking your dog having the shower and

1533
00:57:38,789 --> 00:57:37,760
you think that's what i should have

1534
00:57:40,390 --> 00:57:38,799
asked them

1535
00:57:43,349 --> 00:57:40,400
please don't lose it put it in the

1536
00:57:45,190 --> 00:57:43,359
discussion forum and that will help to

1537
00:57:46,390 --> 00:57:45,200
drive the process for the road mapping

1538
00:57:48,309 --> 00:57:46,400
activity

1539
00:57:51,510 --> 00:57:48,319
so with that thank you very much to our